Curse

tyrant rex · Jan 29, 2009, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by N1ghtstalker

edit: just made some calculations
at 16 smite [ray of judgment] is good for around 338 damage
at 16 fire magic [savannah heat] packs 315 fire damage
compare recharge and energy cost and you'll pretty much know where this is going to
RoJ = SH for monks with a shiney animation

wasnt aware that sh was armor ignoring dmng like roj , stupid calculations are stupid

roj needs to get scatter added the fact that its armor ignoring aoe that dosent cause scatter is insane

cry of pain needs to get nerfed along with sy tntf sf and con sets. while none of these skills are as big an i win button as ursan there still ridiculous just because you need to have a few other skills to make the combo work dosent make the combo any less imbalanced . perma invincibilty is a stupid idea especially with the piss poor ai in this game that will ball around an sf tank and swing away till they all die from massive aoe armor ignoring cry spike

and people wonder why there are secret balance forums, because none of you seem to understand basic guild wars

riktw · Jan 29, 2009, 08:30 PM // 20:30

roj is a bit overpowered, but still not perfect, ursan used to be far more powerfull.
maybe make damage a bit less of RoJ, and for CoP, keep it that way.
finally mesmers can do pve and kill thinks, and monk killing thinks is fun, but strange, still fun

Tyla · Jan 29, 2009, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by riktw

roj is a bit overpowered, but still not perfect, ursan used to be far more powerfull.
maybe make damage a bit less of RoJ, and for CoP, keep it that way.
finally mesmers can do pve and kill thinks, and monk killing thinks is fun, but strange, still fun

Mesmers could always PvE.

N1ghtstalker · Jan 29, 2009, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

wasnt aware that sh was armor ignoring dmng like roj , stupid calculations are stupid

roj needs to get scatter added the fact that its armor ignoring aoe that dosent cause scatter is insane

cry of pain needs to get nerfed along with sy tntf sf and con sets. while none of these skills are as big an i win button as ursan there still ridiculous just because you need to have a few other skills to make the combo work dosent make the combo any less imbalanced . perma invincibilty is a stupid idea especially with the piss poor ai in this game that will ball around an sf tank and swing away till they all die from massive aoe armor ignoring cry spike

and people wonder why there are secret balance forums, because none of you seem to understand basic guild wars

so what
monks finally have someting good for offence and they're still not the best in nuking
now they can just compare to other powerful nukers like an SH ele with a full bar of AoE

tyrant rex · Jan 29, 2009, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by N1ghtstalker

so what
monks finally have someting good for offence and they're still not the best in nuking
now they can just compare to other powerful nukers like an SH ele with a full bar of AoE

monks were designed as a support character the fact that they can now compete with a class designed to do big aoe dmng should tell you something is wrong , but your an idiot

N1ghtstalker · Jan 29, 2009, 08:46 PM // 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

monks were designed as a support character the fact that they can now compete with a class designed to do big aoe dmng should tell you something is wrong , but your an idiot

so cuz monks are used for healing the most says they can't be used in an offensive way?
that's like saying women are only there for cooking and cleaning cuz they do that the most

tyrant rex · Jan 29, 2009, 08:55 PM // 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by N1ghtstalker

so cuz monks are used for healing the most says they can't be used in an offensive way?
that's like saying women are only there for cooking and cleaning cuz they do that the most

what a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing stupid comparison

atm arcane echo+ roj is better then a nuker bar because roj dmng is armor ignoring and fire nukers arent , in hm wheres monsters have massive armor/health buffs armor ignoring dmng is they way to go (also why crys dmng is insane) also a smiters bar compression is a lot better then the standard nukers its fine if a class can do multiple things , its imbalanced when a class that wasn't designed for aoe dmng can out do a class that was while still having access to alot of utility

taiwf · Jan 29, 2009, 11:12 PM // 23:12

what is the point of nerfing skill that bring player to play a dead (eg. DoA or any pve elite area)? PVE is dead. Nerfing pve skill only waste developer time and ensure abosolute 0 player participate elite area.

I see it as lose lose situation. No point to waste everyone's time.
NO SIGN for either skill.

Age · Jan 29, 2009, 11:19 PM // 23:19

/Not signed for both .I only use RoJ when I H/H and it is the only elite I use.I never use CoP even on my Mesmer.I would suggest if you want scatter then all AoE skill cause sactter which means fire.I remember the FS scatter very well and it was not very effective to damage mobs.

I don't think Izzy really cares about this game as much as he use to and look what he did with smiters boon.I don't want this skill ending up like that one.

joshuarodger · Jan 30, 2009, 12:25 AM // 00:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

wasnt aware that sh was armor ignoring dmng like roj , stupid calculations are stupid

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

monks were designed as a support character the fact that they can now compete with a class designed to do big aoe dmng should tell you something is wrong , but your an idiot

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

what a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing stupid comparison

atm arcane echo+ roj is better then a nuker bar because roj dmng is armor ignoring and fire nukers arent , in hm wheres monsters have massive armor/health buffs armor ignoring dmng is they way to go (also why crys dmng is insane) also a smiters bar compression is a lot better then the standard nukers its fine if a class can do multiple things , its imbalanced when a class that wasn't designed for aoe dmng can out do a class that was while still having access to alot of utility

if you're going to call some stupid and classify all of their arguments, valid or otherwise, as stupid, learn to spell and punctuate properly. otherwise it makes you look stupid.

there's no "n" in "damage".

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcyFiftyFive

Also note that SH allows you to take Teinai's Heat, Searing Heat, etc... while RoJ allows you no extra AoE damage on your bar.

[smite hex][smite condition][balthazar's aura][kirin's wrath][symbol of wrath][zealot's fire]

looks like some AoE damage to me, especially if you have a 600 or permasin... granted for the wraths to work, you have to be in the middle of everything but the others still qualify as AoE. ohai icy

jaximus · Jan 30, 2009, 12:35 AM // 00:35

as for CoP, make it like there is nothing to fear, it should scale in fast casting. then mesmers will be the people running it instead of all the junk running it now. they wanted mesmers to be better at pve, so make it more mesmery. right now its mostly ele/me cryers for the higher energy pool.

simple solution for roj. keep it as is, cuz then the pugs can not fail all the time, but give it exhaustion. then in fa/jq there wont be so many horribad monks roj->die->roj->die..., theyd have to wait for some energy back. no aoe scatter.. meh, deep freeze and it doesnt matter anyway.

Eragon Zarroc · Jan 30, 2009, 01:54 AM // 01:54

another QQ thread. there is always gonna be stuff that is overpowered unless anet feels like changing it. everyone is gonna use it until it's nerfed. some advice: use the shit out of it until it is nerfed. if u don't want to use it based on some twisted self-righteous gameplay morals, then too bad for u. don't bother everyone else with ur stupid ramblings. go be leet with balanced builds and stfu. no one cares.

draxynnic · Jan 30, 2009, 03:35 AM // 03:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

wasnt aware that sh was armor ignoring dmng like roj , stupid calculations are stupid

roj needs to get scatter added the fact that its armor ignoring aoe that dosent cause scatter is insane

But why should RoJ cause scatter if Savannah Heat, say, doesn't? I'd say the Heat spells encourage scattering more because their strongest effect happens on the last pulse. RoJ, on the other hand, the victim is still burning for 3 seconds after they get out!

And then there's Maelstrom, which pretty much completely shuts down a spellcaster for its duration until they get out - shouldn't they scatter out of it too?

Sounds to me like it's a general issue - RoJ may be one of the more visible cases where lack of scatter is a problem due to its power, but I don't think this means it should be singled out to cause scatter when the others don't - instead, there should be a general AI script for deciding when an NPC scatters.

If RoJ really is not causing scatter where other DotAoEs are, than that's a bug that needs to be fixed. If other DotAoEs are not causing scatter, than that's a general problem that would probably better improve the game by fixing for all such skills than RoJ specifically.

(For the record, by my understanding, enemies are supposed to scatter in Hard but not in Normal. Alliance Battles and the like I haven't participated in, but unless there's a good reason for them to remain in place regardless, if they don't scatter now they should.)

Silverhand · Jan 30, 2009, 04:29 AM // 04:29

The idea of tying cop to fast casting reminds me alot of the way ursan groups wanted wars only for the armor
Now elite areas will require mesmers
Whereas now app classes can go /me
And yes even warriors can
I just doa with a war cryer so don't tell me it doesn't work
/notsigned for cop to be tied with fast casting
Elite areas don't need more class discrimination

Joshgt2 · Jan 30, 2009, 05:08 AM // 05:08

I love how people nowadays are able to use their monks again to farm dungeons and certain areas in TEAMS using Ray of Judgment and they want to complain about it. This skill allows for many of the high end items to be farmed if you know what your doing and a great way to know how to work in a team. I don't see how these skills are overpowered really. Make RoJ scatter foes, then my team will simply bring Earthen Shakles and watch them not be able to move, are you going to complain about earth hexes then?

jaximus · Jan 30, 2009, 05:39 AM // 05:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silverhand

The idea of tying cop to fast casting reminds me alot of the way ursan groups wanted wars only for the armor
Now elite areas will require mesmers
Whereas now app classes can go /me
And yes even warriors can
I just doa with a war cryer so don't tell me it doesn't work
/notsigned for cop to be tied with fast casting
Elite areas don't need more class discrimination

the whole point of cry of pain was to promote mesmer pve, dont see how you dont get it. also, elite areas are sposed to be elite. not pug faceroll the keyboard. and yes, there should be more class descrimination. bad players dont have mesmers, they have warriors -> your point about warrior cryers....

thor hammerbane · Jan 30, 2009, 05:43 AM // 05:43

PVE is SRS BSNS

A11Eur0 · Jan 30, 2009, 08:15 AM // 08:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrant rex

wasnt aware that sh was armor ignoring dmng like roj , stupid calculations are stupid

roj needs to get scatter added the fact that its armor ignoring aoe that dosent cause scatter is insane

Notice the energy cost between the two. Monks have less energy (half on average) to start with and it costs 3x more. Recharge and cast time are also higher. That balances out the "armor ignoring" portion of it.

xDusT II · Jan 30, 2009, 10:57 AM // 10:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

Notice the energy cost between the two. Monks have less energy (half on average) to start with and it costs 3x more. Recharge and cast time are also higher. That balances out the "armor ignoring" portion of it.

RoJ is 10e not 15e.

Silverhand · Jan 30, 2009, 12:58 PM // 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaximus

the whole point of cry of pain was to promote mesmer pve, dont see how you dont get it. also, elite areas are sposed to be elite. not pug faceroll the keyboard. and yes, there should be more class descrimination. bad players dont have mesmers, they have warriors -> your point about warrior cryers....

I was just saying that right now all classes can cry
And I'm not a bad player.
No reason to imply that with ur arguement
All I was saying is that having to create a Mesmer and grind sunspear again in order to get into groups in elite areas seems alot like the old ursan days where everyone had to make a warrior for the armor